Interview With Sinclair Sexsmith of Sugarbutch Chronicles
Sinclair (they/them) is the founder and writer behind Sugarbutch Chronicles, a blog of their personal and explicit writings on kink practices, Dominant/submissive relationships, and queer kink erotica (among other things). In today’s episode of the Between Our Thighs podcast, we sat down with Sinclair to talk about Cleis Press’ new anthology, Best Lesbian Erotica of the Year Volume 5 (of which they are the editor), their website Sugarbutch Chronicles, gender, and the world of kink.
Here is the transcript of our podcast interview below. You can also download or stream the audio podcast here!
Between Our Thighs: If it wasn’t already obvious, we love good erotica. Like, we really love it. So, when Sinclair Sexsmith of the blog Sugarbutch Chronicles reached out for us to read and review Cleis Press’ upcoming collection — that they’re the editor of — we couldn’t say “no.”
Best Lesbian Erotica of the Year: Volume 5 was amazing. The anthology explores and expands on the very definition of eroticism, with a diverse mix of queer, non-binary, trans, and polyamorous #OwnVoices that will have you quivering with delight and wondering what more you can explore, no matter how you identify.
Today, we’re talking to Sinclair about the erotica collection, which releases on December 8th, and also about their website Sugarbutch Chronicles and the world of kink.
Hello, Sinclair! How are you?
Sinclair Sexsmith: I’m doing so well, thank you. How are you doing?
BOT: I’m doing great! Do you want to tell us a little bit about yourself? Where you’re based out of? What you’re doing these crazy COVID times?
Sinclair: Sure! So, I’m a writer; I’ve been a writer for as long as I can remember, and I started publishing erotica about fifteen years ago. That’s primarily what I write: erotica and non-fiction, creative essays around sexual identity, kink, gender, relationships... things like that.
BOT: That’s amazing.
Sinclair: This year’s been just bonkers! [Laughs]
BOT: To say the least.
Sinclair: To say the least! The first thing that happened, was that my partner and I ran for a leather title in March and we won.
BOT: Congratulations!
Sinclair: Thank you, but then the same week that happened, the state of California went on their first lockdown. So, we got home thinking we were going to be travelling all over the country and all over the world, but we came home the very serious global pandemic. So, we have been teaching online some, doing things online, but we definitely didn’t have the title year that we thought we would.
BOT: Are you going to get to do that next year?
Sinclair: No, it’s over in March. It’s completely done in March, so — I mean, we’ll still be doing some of it and we've spent a lot of years travelling around to leather conferences and conventions and things. Teaching, and attending, and learning, and playing, so we’ll keep doing that, but it’ll be a little different because we won’t be actively in the title year.
BOT: Yeah. Is it possible to re-enter in the future?
Sinclair: You know, this is one of those ones where you win once. You’re a titleholder forever; I’ll always be the 2020 titleholder, so it’ll just be a little different because it won’t be the actual year, but that’s — it’s not what we expected, but it is what it is. In some ways, we have a lot of experience teaching online, so in some ways, it was a good match to teach online for our year.
BOT: And you’ll be the only ones that were the winner of the Pandemic Year.
Sinclair: That’s so true. It will be memorable that way.
BOT: You’ve recently edited a collection of erotica, called Best Lesbian Erotica of the Year: Volume 5. What led you to lend your voice to this anthology?
Sinclair: That’s right. So, this series is almost twenty-five years old now.
BOT: Wow.
Sinclair: It started in the late nineties and Clies Press has been a queer and erotica publisher for a long time. Tristan Taormino helped to start the series and then it’s had a couple other series editors over the years, but I’m the current editor and I edited Volume 4, and I’m also going to edit Volume 6. It’ll come out next year, although that’s not out yet. I’m just starting to read the submissions for that now.
The first piece of erotica I published, actually — well, maybe not the first-first, but the first big piece I published — was in the Best Lesbian Erotica Series in 2006. It has been profoundly influential on my work and on my erotic life, in general. My understanding of what lesbians do in bed, and what they like, and how things work about sex toys, about kink. I was honoured to be a part of it, to have a story in it, and I’ve been really honoured to support it over the years and even more honoured to be editing it now. So, I’ve had a long journey with this series, and it’s really exciting to be editing it now.
BOT: That’s amazing! I guess, to everyone, sex has a different definition, a different meaning. It can be practised in different ways. So, yeah, to be able to read — I was able to read Volume 5 — and just to see the different perspectives of sex. Whether it’s physical, emotional, on some spiritual levels. It’s really good. It’s a really good collection, I really enjoyed it.
Sinclair: Thank you! Yeah, I think that was one of the big things that came through this year, was this exploration of what is erotic? What does it mean for something to be erotic? What does it mean to have something be erotic? There are multiple characters in this edition who are asexual or greysexual in some form, or who don’t want to be touched, so they have to find — they want to find — other ways to connect and have some moments of their own agency. Of saying, “This is what I like. This is what I want. This is how I want to have sex. This is how I want to be touched.”
BOT: And it’s so erotic!
Sinclair: Mhmm, yeah! I love that.
BOT: I loved your introduction to the collection. Did you want to read it out loud for us?
Sinclair: Sure, I’d love to.
I love reading erotica. It thrills me in the way only words strung together in cadence and rhythm and assonance can; it drops me to my knees, with relief in the expression that I understand, I feel, I know, I connect.
It is the relief that I’m not alone.
And, not to get personal here but, I love sex. I love the magic of our sensate bodies, how they fit together, what it’s like to touch and be touched, to smell and see and hear and taste, to be as close to another as we really possibly can be, to even be inside one another.
But erotica isn’t only about sex. In fact, some of the most erotic writing I’ve ever read doesn’t describe a single sex act — it might just describe something extra-sensorial, something sensuous, something full of longing or want or anticipation.
“Erotic” can be far more than just sex, far more than genitals touching, mouths touching, hands touching. It still usually has to do with our bodies, with our senses — luscious food can be erotic, incredible art can be erotic, smacking the ball with the center of the bat to make that perfect arc way into the outfield can be erotic.
All kinds of things elicit something akin to an erotic response. This collection of stories is a meditation expanding on the idea of what eroticism is. Is it imagining touching, energetically connecting? Is it pleasing another? Is it service? Is it blood? Is it tender kissing? Is it an emotionally secure enough attachment to one-up the relationship? Is it not knowing whose body parts are whose? Is it pain, is it fear?
The characters in this book explore all kinds of erotic encounters, finding refuge, finding connection, and finding themselves.
Wherever you are in your exploration of sexuality, of eros, and of queer sex, I hope you find something deliciously erotic in here.
BOT: Ooh, I have goosebumps!
Sinclair: [Laughs]
BOT: It was brilliant, brilliantly written. I love how you said that erotica doesn’t have to be about sex. Where do you find eroticism in the everyday?
Sinclair: Mmm... The big thing that comes to mind — I guess there’s two — one is food. [Laughs]
BOT: That was the first thing I thought of.
Sinclair: Absolutely, yeah, me too! You know, the more I dive into my own spiritual practices, the more all of the things that I do are related to my spiritual path and pursuits. So, something like honouring where the food came from, honouring the people who picked and grew and made this food. Often, it’s me who’s made the food, especially during COVID times, but not always.
BOT: That’s amazing.
Sinclair: [Laughs] I do a lot of cooking. I don’t grow much of my own food, so honouring the people and the distance it’s taken, the sunshine, the soil, the nutrients in the earth. Just having a moment to say “thank you for that” feels like part of my spiritual practice. When things get loaded with spirit in that way, they also feel more erotic to me, you know?
BOT: For sure.
Sinclair: So, food is a big one. There’s just the sensuality of it, you know? Like, is something crunchy, or is it smooth and silky, or is it creamy, or is it — what is actually happening in your mouth? [Laughs] let along the taste!
BOT: Brilliantly said!
Sinclair: Mhmm! There’s so many ways food is erotic, so of course that comes to mind.
Secondly, the thing that isn’t sex, but is very erotic that comes to mind immediately, is kink. I live with a 24/7 service submissive. My boy is my own property [laughs], so the service that I receive, the attention, the care that I get every day is always erotic to me, and that is a big piece of my day-to-day life and of our dynamic together.
BOT: That’s awesome. Anything else that comes to mind?
Sinclair: Oh, man. I mean, there’s so much.
BOT: There really is.
Sinclair: I’m sheltering in place in Southeast Alaska right now. I’ve lived in California the last ten years, but I’m now in Alaska at a family home.
BOT: That’s a big difference in temperature. [Laughs]
Sinclair: Yeah, totally. I’ve been playing in the snow lately and there’s something really erotic about being covered in snow or the perfect snowball hit. I don’t know the last time you went ice skating, but the way that the blade cuts the ice, so that you can balance precisely on it... I find that erotic, too.
BOT: I’m based in Toronto, so it gets pretty cold here. We go ice skating a lot in the winters.
Sinclair: Awesome.
BOT: We actually had our first major snowfall yesterday.
Sinclair: Oh, cool!
BOT: I looked out the window and I’m like, “Oh, this is going to be my life until March.” [Laughs]
Sinclair: Yes, yes.
BOT: Yeah, but diverging a bit from that, what was your favourite part about editing the collection? What makes Volume 5 special to new readers, who have never read any of the previous anthologies?
Sinclair: Well, I think that the presence of a wide variety of characters is special to this anthology, this particular Volume 5. There are folx with different abilities and different neurodiverse states of their brains, and figuring out the ways to make that work for them, right? Figuring out how erotic encounters will work for their particular situation.
There are a lot of transwomen in this anthology, as well.
BOT: I noticed that; I really liked that.
Sinclair: Thanks! Some people have the opinion that transwomen do not belong in lesbian spaces and I do not have that opinion at all.
BOT: No!
Sinclair: I think they are absolutely essential to lesbian spaces. So, I do anticipate some critique of that. I think that it’s very important to continue making that visible, because transwomen have always been in lesbian spaces, it’s just not always been acceptable.
BOT: And it should be!
Sinclair: Absolutely, absolutely. I’m excited just to support that happening, that visible happening.
BOT: And to give a voice, for sure.
Sinclair: Mhmm, and to — you know, the people who are writing about transwomen characters are, mostly, transwomen themselves (or non-binary folk), so that’s important to me, too. That their #OwnVoices, to use the hashtag — by people who have that experience.
BOT: Exactly, and that makes it so much more real and so much more erotic, as well.
Sinclair: Mhmm, mhmm. Yeah. Well, I mean they can really get into the psyche when they have their own experiences of similar issues.
BOT: And as a reader, you can tell the difference, for sure.
Sinclair: I think so, too. Yeah.
BOT: And you contributed your own piece of erotica to the collection — which, by the way, was super well-written — and it’s called ‘Whatever I Want, Whatever I Say.’ What was the inspiration behind it?
Sinclair: That’s a great question! [Laughs] It actually comes from a sexy, porny gif that I found on Tumblr.
BOT: Oh, wow!
Sinclair: I think it’s a scene with Stoya, who’s a gorgeous, amazing, skilled pornstar. The clip, it’s just a little rotating gif, and I believe it says “Whatever I want.” It might have even said those two lines: “I’m going to do whatever I want and you’re going to do whatever I say.” So, that’s exactly where it came from. I used that as a prompt and just wrote my own story.
BOT: That’s so cool!
Sinclair: Mhmm. [Laughs]
BOT: And do you find that reading erotica helps you write your own?
Sinclair: Yeah, I think that it’s a fine line, for me, where sometimes if I read too much, I get too bogged down with other people’s ideas, that I need some time to have my own mind just wandering by itself.
BOT: For sure.
Sinclair: But absolutely! I feel so inspired by the ways that people can capture moments of transformation or moments of erotic liberation in their stories. It always makes me want to write more and do more with my stories.
BOT: Yeah, for sure. On that note, do you think that reading erotica can enhance a person’s ability to become more attuned to their sexual partners, or even to their own sexual well-being and personal desires?
Sinclair: Oh, I definitely do. I think reading — and maybe even more so writing it, regardless of if someone thinks they’re a writer, or if they’re ever going to show it to anybody, except for maybe one person — it can be an incredibly transformative tool to think about, and work with, and learn, and unlearn what our own erotic desires are, what out own erotic psyche looks like, what kind of shame we’ve tucked away in there. When we notice the shame that comes up, I think that shame and desire are kind of two sides of the same coin, and I think if shame can cancel desire, then maybe desire can cancel shame.
BOT: That is so interesting, because I literally just spoke about that this morning with my therapist. [Laughs]
Sinclair: Oh, wow! [Laughs]
BOT: Yeah, that exact topic. That’s what we spent our hour session talking about.
Sinclair: Wow, awesome. Yeah, I’ve had a couple conversations about it recently, too. I think it’s really interesting, and I think there’s so much power in desire that we don’t necessarily even understand or know about yet. I think we’re still learning what that means.
BOT: For sure.
Do you want to tell us a little bit about your own journey with gender identity?
Sinclair: I grew up in Alaska, so the gender expression and expectation for women here is a little different than it is in many other places where gender is pretty practical because of the elements.
BOT: Mhmm.
Sinclair: I didn’t really grow up a tomboy, I wore a lot of dresses, but I definitely had different expectations on me than I would have had in other places. If I had been in California or somewhere, I probably would have been deemed a ‘tomboy,’ just for what I wore here. You know what I mean?
So, I came out and came into a butch identity in my late teens in the late nineties — I was like eighteen in ‘97 — and came to identifying as butch, which really was what resonated with me and what still resonates with me. That’s been more than twenty years now.
Over the years, people use different words for the masculinity on an assigned-female-at-birth type of body, from androgynous to gender-queer, and now people are mostly using nono-binary and I’ve adapted that word as well, to use for myself. Which I like! I like the word ‘non-binary’; I think it works for me, as far as meaning “outside of the binary system,” which I do see myself as outside of that.
But it’s been a big journey, for sure, and reconciling the wanting to be a Dominant with my masculinity has been challenging, and with my feminism has been challenging. Because of the expectations that dominants — “men are dominant,” right? — this cultural alignment assumptions that dominance is for men and submission is for women, I definitely had to look at myself and go, “Well, am I wanting to be dominant because I am masculine? Am I just taking this on as a masculine trait, or am I wanting to be masculine because I feel dominant? What about if I was feminine and dominant?” I really had to undo some of my cultural learning about that and question it. Think about.
Ultimately, it fell onto the clear side that absolutely, yes, I identify as dominant and I identify as butch and masculine, and there’s nothing wrong with these things going together when I think they’re not compulsory or feel like they’re required from the culture. I think that there are people who have that combination, and that’s just fine.
BOT: Yeah, and you can be feminine and dominant or masculine and submissive. One doesn’t have to equate to the other.
Sinclair: Right! I think that all of these are valid choices, the problem is when some of these choices are not accessible to us. So, when I felt more like I could be any of these things and it would be fine, then it felt more like I could authentically choose the one that felt right for me, rather than feeling like I had to only choose this one.
BOT: I’m so glad that you found that in yourself.
Sinclair: Mhmm.
BOT: If you could give advice to someone questioning their gender identity, whether they’re Dominant or submissive — say, in that same ‘small-town Alaskan’ setting — what would you tell them?
Sinclair: [Laughs] I think it depends — ah, I’m biased because erotica has been a huge way that I have learned myself, shaped myself, re-shaped myself, explored myself. Both reading and writing erotica. I think it depends on the person’s make-up. Words are my medium, in a really big way; I really identify with the artistic expression of letting words come through me.
BOT: Mhmm.
Sinclair: And it doesn’t work for everybody, you know? So, if words are not your expression, dance about it. Write about it. Make art about it. Maybe even fuck about it! It might end up being a very productive slutty phase, of just having a lot of sex.
BOT: [Laughs] Yep!
Sinclair: [Laughs] That can be really helpful to let go and actually experiment with people. Hopefully, you’re experimenting with people and not on people, right?
BOT: Mhmm.
Sinclair: Making the distinction.
BOT: Thank you.
Sinclair: I think experimentation and openness and finding the medium that the experimentation works for someone. It might not be erotica, but it might be! Erotica has been the way that I’ve done it, for sure.
BOT: Your website, that you post your own erotica on, is called “Sugarbutch.” “Butch” is a term, like you said, that’s typically used to describe lesbian women with more ‘masculine’ qualities, while ‘sugar’ is typically seen as sweet and submissive and more (quote, unquote) ‘feminine’ qualities. So, what made you choose these dichotomous words, as opposed to something that didn’t lean towards being characterized as either ‘masculine’ or ‘feminine’?
Sinclair: Well, it came from an ex of mine, from an old girlfriend of mine, who — when I was coming into a butch identity in the late nineties — she was like, “I don’t know, you’re not really that butch. You’re more of a sugarbutch.” So, that kind of stuck and that was a little bit of a play for a while.
It was amazing when I would actually say to people, “Yeah, I identify as butch” and they’d say, “Oh, no, no! Don’t say that about yourself. You’re not that butch, you’re not butch. It’s okay.” As if that was...
BOT: As if that was a bad thing!
Sinclair: A bad thing or an insult. That was probably twenty years ago now, really, so I think it’s changed a lot since then, but I know there’s still pockets of people who think of it as a bad thing. I think people would challenge me because, they’re like, “But you like poetry and you have feelings.” You know, these kinds of stereotypic ‘feminine’ things.
BOT: [Laughs]
Sinclair: Like, you’re not ‘dude,’ I guess. I don’t know. You don’t work on cars?
BOT: [Laughs]
Sinclair: I’m trying to think of a stereotype, but I think that over the years, I really feel like identities need to conform to the person. The person doesn’t need to conform to the identity. So, I’m interested in being inside of a word like ‘butch,’ that can flex and hold my identity or someone who only works on cars. You know, a much more stereotype about masculine gender roles.
Meanwhile, I want to work with poetry and feelings and doodling flowers, if I want to do that — which I’ve spent a fair amount of time doing in this at-home year. [Laughs]
BOT: [Laughs]
Sinclair: I think that ‘butch’ has room for all of those things.
BOT: For sure. I love that. It doesn’t have to have a specific — there’s no set rule of what it has to be.
Sinclair: Yeah, right! And I think we really need to expand what masculinity is and means, and butches, and masculine, and AFAB [assigned female at birth] folx, and transmasculine folx are really challenging and expanding what masculinity is and means. Challenging a lot of the assumptions about the masculine gender roles that we have in this culture. So, it’s a place for the folx on the margins of gender; they really have gifts to give the mainstream.
BOT: And your website kind of ties into this idea. Is that what inspired you to launch it?
Sinclair: Yes! The website came around because — it was actually a different girlfriend, but it was a similar time period, where I was in a relationship, but we really weren't having sex at all. We had sex five times in the last two years we were together and I was counting and it was horrible.
BOT: Oh, my God! That’s awful.
Sinclair: It was not enough and I was going nuts. But you know, I was like, “But I love her!” So, I decided that every time I wanted to have sex, I would either go to the gym or I would write erotica. I ended up writing a lot of erotica and not really going to the gym very much. [Laughs]
BOT: [Laughs]
Sinclair: I started writing things that I kind of liked and wanted to share. At that point, it was 2006 and I had already been writing online for about ten years. I started writing on certain websites in 1996, so I did what I knew to do with writing that I liked, which was to create an anonymous blog and share it with people. That’s how that started, how Sugarbutch started. On Blogspot in 2006.
BOT: Wow!
Sinclair: And moved to Wordpress and now it’s on its own domain. It was a project that was about writing my way to a better sex life, which, for me, was also about being dominant and being masculine. Like, how do I reconcile those things? How do I write about it and think about it? How do I go out and find the kind of people that I want to have sex with? How do I find a bottom who wants to receive the kind of things that I want to give?
All of those questions, and it was all about reflecting on my sex life, which included kink and gender, and figuring out how to have a sex life that I wanted. You know, ten years later into the project, I am absolutely satisfied with my sex life and with my partner.
So, I would say that it was successful, but it was time-consuming.
BOT: I think it was worth the investment! [Laughs]
Sinclair: Mhmm! I think so too, absolutely!
BOT: Last year, in 2019, you were voted number on Kinkly’s roundup for both queer sex blogs and erotica sex blogs. Obviously, you don’t reach that level of recognition when you’re not putting your heart and soul into the content that you create.
Sinclair: Awe, thank you. Yeah, thanks.
BOT: Like you said, you write a lot of poetry that’s published on your website, too.
Sinclair: Mhmm.
BOT: What inspired you to take your emotions, and your desires, and your experiences to put pen to paper — so to speak — in this form?
Sinclair: Hmm. I’d say that poetry is actually more part of my spiritual practices than anything else. It’s about listening in this way that I can... It’s kind of hard to describe, but I try to get as clear as I can and listen and let something come through me.
BOT: Mhmm.
Sinclair: It kind of feels like channeling in a way, although I don;t think of it as any particular entity or anything. Just kind of listening to myself. Maybe it’s about my higher self, or what messages that my Self or Spirit or the Universe or whatever can bring to me. A lot of the poerty is about that and a lot of it is journaling. It’s just the way that I know how to process my own feelings and my own experiences.
Poetry, and writing in general, are my best tools for making sense of my life, and so I do it very selfishly, to make sense of it. To understand what I’m going through. I put it out there because I’ve put work out there for more than twenty years and people connect with it and say it’s valuable to read what other people are going through. I enjoy sharing and connecting with people that way.
BOT: That description alone is poetic. [Laughs]
Sinclair: Oh, thank you.
BOT: No problem.
Sinclair: I think part of Best Lesbian Erotica — not to bring it all back around — I feel so honoured to be a part of this series because it does feel like it’s connecting me to a lineage of writers. Back to Tristan Taormino, but also folx like Jewelle Gomez, or Pat Califia, or Carol Queen. Many of the folx that I grew up [with] and came into a queer identity reading their work and being inspired by them and looking up to them.
Lineage really matters to me and being a part of a lineage of people who have these consensual power dynamics and who have been thinking deeply about the psychology, the philosophy, the spirituality of them really matters to me. It’s just been life-changing to be inside of that community and talking about it.
BOT: Yeah, definitely. For Between Our Thighs, our ultimate goal is sex-positivism. Of course, the idea of sex-positivity takes on a different meaning for each individual person who hears it. So, I want to know, what does it mean for you?
Sinclair: To me, it means honouring people’s consent and agency. I think that if what someone wants, if what their desires are, is missionary sex that’s basically heterosexual with the lights off, that can be a very sex-positive experience. It doesn’t have to be the kinkiest stuff. Sometimes, I think we equate “sex-positivity” with certain acts, like “These are so sex-positive,” but I think it’s much more on the philosophy and how we approach it, than it is in any particular thing.
BOT: In your opinion, how can someone become more sex-positive?
Sinclair: Education is the first step, I think. Just learning. We all have gaps in our sexuality education, just learning what things are, even learning body parts, learning embodiment, learning different options for sex, and exploring. Finding exploration partners who are really into exploring what you’re into exploring and seeing what you like and what you don’t like. I think that is the best way to think about it and work with it.
Not everyone is into reading and writing the way that I am, so maybe it’s film or movies, documentaries. Maybe it’s following Instagram people, sex-positive people in Instagram. There’s lots of mediums, other than just reading, but getting some education and filling in the gaps of knowledge, for sure.
BOT: Perfectly said.
Sinclair: Thank you.
BOT: Well, thank you for joining us. I really appreciate it.
Sinclair: It’s my pleasure! Thanks for having me. I really appreciate helping spread the word about the book and I’m so excited to hear what people think about it, now that it’s almost out int he world and just starting to get some reviews up! Very stoked to talk to you and chat about the book a little more. Thank you.
BOT: Sounds great. No problem. Have a great day!
Sinclair: Thanks so much.
